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0 pointsechelon5y ago0 comments

Under these circumstances, how is AWS lock-in and cost escalation any different from Oracle of the past?

Why would any startup shackle themselves to AWS or any cloud when it's not portable?

Lambdas, in particular, seem like the worst idea in the history of ideas. Once your org adopts them, how do you keep track of these mysterious, business-critical pieces of functionality? How do you ever plan to port them to something else? It seems like you become an Amazon customer forever.

I am incredibly skeptical of cloud at this point. If the other infrastructure and platform concerns of OS upgrades, patches, etc. were handled in an automated way, I'd strongly consider running Kubernetes on bare metal. Data centers and colocation all the way.

I'm eager for self-management of k8s, DBs, Redis, etc. to be automated with tooling. On-prem, but easy to maintain.

edit: wow, from +3 to 0 after an hour. I maintain that I articulated my opinion well in an unbiased way.

0 comments

chrisco2555y ago

Lambdas, at least the JS ones, are Node.js based and not hard at all to migrate to an alternative cloud service. You can even use a framework that handles all the cloud-specific functionality for you and works across AWS, Azure, GCloud, etc: https://www.serverless.com/

The lock-in really comes from AWS-specific services. Redis, Mongo, etc will have the same API no matter where you're hosting them, so it's pretty trivial to point your client-side code to a different cloud-hosted Redis instance if you find AWS lacking there.

mwakerman5y ago

I agree and just want to add IAM to the list of AWS Lock In services. We provisions environments almost entirely using Config-as-code tools (packer, ansible, terraform) and generally have a good blueprint for what an environment looks like and the parts I’ve had the hardest time thinking about migrating to another cloud provider is all the IAM rules that magically give hosts/services the ability to talk to other services.

cosmie5y ago

I'm not sure about GCP, but Azure does offer role-based access[1] which gives you similar resource authentication magic to what IAM provides. The definition formats[2] even look fairly close to their IAM equivalents.

It's used in combination with Azure Active Directory, so the modality isn't 1:1 with AWS. But Managed Identities[3] is a feature that's rolling out across Azure which simplifies the model a bit, since it negates the need to create service principles in AAD beforehand.

[1] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/role-based-access-con...

[2] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/role-based-access-con...

[3] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/active-directory/mana...

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AmericanChopper5y ago

IAM is simply one of AWS's killer features. It's just a service that's so good it differentiates itself from the competition. Lock-in based on quality is not the sort of lock-in that I'm most worried about, because it's very clear what I'm getting in return for it. The alternative to using IAM to begin with would be to commit to work comparable in scope to that required to migrate away from it in the future.

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jfim5y ago

> Why would any startup shackle themselves to AWS or any cloud when it's not portable?

Depending on the startup, that may make sense if it allows for fast iteration.

If a startup is trying to achieve product market fit, having a huge AWS bill is a good problem to have, since it means the product is actually successful.

ezeev5y ago

If you're building on AWS properly, your usage scales with demand. So a huge bill should mean you have huge demand.

dx0345y ago

Only servers used for client requests. Dev and integration environments but esp data crunching can be a lot more expensive than serving web requests. And they're hard to keep cheap if you scaling is easy.

gjs2785y ago

it’s not even slightly difficult to get a huge AWS bill. people do it on accident because they refuse to put in spend limits.

scarface745y ago

Do you realize how many software as a service vendors the average corporation is tied in to?

You’re always tied into your infrastructure once you have any type of scale. The pain of migration is huge.

I once worked with a company whose entire workflow was integrated with six or seven vendors through APIs.

Have you ever worked in the healthcare industry? The level of lock-in they have to their EMR/EHR would make you cry.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 pointsechelon5y ago0 comments

Under these circumstances, how is AWS lock-in and cost escalation any different from Oracle of the past?

Why would any startup shackle themselves to AWS or any cloud when it's not portable?

I'm eager for self-management of k8s, DBs, Redis, etc. to be automated with tooling. On-prem, but easy to maintain.

edit: wow, from +3 to 0 after an hour. I maintain that I articulated my opinion well in an unbiased way.

0 comments

chrisco2555y ago

mwakerman5y ago

cosmie5y ago

[1] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/role-based-access-con...

[2] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/role-based-access-con...

[3] https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/active-directory/mana...

1 more reply

AmericanChopper5y ago

1 more reply

jfim5y ago

> Why would any startup shackle themselves to AWS or any cloud when it's not portable?

Depending on the startup, that may make sense if it allows for fast iteration.

If a startup is trying to achieve product market fit, having a huge AWS bill is a good problem to have, since it means the product is actually successful.

ezeev5y ago

If you're building on AWS properly, your usage scales with demand. So a huge bill should mean you have huge demand.

dx0345y ago

gjs2785y ago

it’s not even slightly difficult to get a huge AWS bill. people do it on accident because they refuse to put in spend limits.

scarface745y ago

Do you realize how many software as a service vendors the average corporation is tied in to?

You’re always tied into your infrastructure once you have any type of scale. The pain of migration is huge.

I once worked with a company whose entire workflow was integrated with six or seven vendors through APIs.

Have you ever worked in the healthcare industry? The level of lock-in they have to their EMR/EHR would make you cry.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse