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0 pointsbarelysapient4y ago0 comments

Depends by who you mean by 'we'.

If you mean America, then coal consumption is down by nearly 50% since 2000[1]. If you mean the EU, then you'll be pleased to know we've also reduced our coal consumption substantially.

The principle increase in coal use is China. They've almost 4x their use of coal in the last 20 years. They also are leading the world in construction of new coal consuming power plants -- both in China and elsewhere[2].

[1]https://www.iea.org/reports/coal-2020/demand [2]https://www.wired.com/story/china-is-still-building-an-insan...

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anonporridge4y ago

> Depends by who you mean by 'we'.

Climate change is a global problem, so the only 'we' that really matters is the whole planet.

The western world decarbonizing after spending well over a century spewing carbon to build out their modern infrastructure is nothing to be deeply proud about, nor sufficient to give the moral high ground to start pointing fingers at the developing world that still wants to get closer to western lifestyles.

Damogran64y ago

We’re just outsourcing our pollution.

anonporridge4y ago

Great point.

Similarly, we didn't actually abolish slavery. We in the west are still benefiting from literal chattel slavery. It's just not happening in our backyard, so we don't have to see it, even if we're still benefiting from it.

imtringued4y ago

Around 14% of China's CO2 emissions can be attributed to exports. If you count the other 86% you're basically saying China is a western colony which it clearly isn't.

Damogran64y ago

If you wish to get pedantic about it, we push our manufacturing desire to places in the world that leverage the lack of employee rights, ecological controls, and resource utilization because it's cheaper.

It's not JUST that we've moved (okay, some percentage) of pollution over there, it's that we've decided to turn a blind eye to ANYTHING you couldn't get away with in America (think overtime, OSHA controls, EPA restrictions, intellectual property theft, money movement)...that does not absolve China from taking care of it's own ecology, which it 'appears' to be doing at a faster rate than us...because they don't have the shackles a pesky democracy or rights or any of those other things that go counter to their desire to control absolutely everything within and without its borders.

https://www.chinaghostcities.com/ https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-10-17/China-steps-up-expandi... https://chinaenv.colgate.edu/airpollution/air-pollution-in-c...

I used to think it'd be a wave that followed cheap labor...I hope it doesn't as I don't think the planet has enough runway to support it.

CameronNemo4y ago

And where do most Chinese exports go to?

itzprime4y ago

Yes, but that is mainly due to the US & EU using more gas.

fulafel4y ago

And "reliant" - most of it goes to goods and services that are just nice to have.

sumedh4y ago

> The principle increase in coal use is China.

because it builds products for US and EU?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 pointsbarelysapient4y ago0 comments

Depends by who you mean by 'we'.

If you mean America, then coal consumption is down by nearly 50% since 2000[1]. If you mean the EU, then you'll be pleased to know we've also reduced our coal consumption substantially.

[1]https://www.iea.org/reports/coal-2020/demand [2]https://www.wired.com/story/china-is-still-building-an-insan...

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anonporridge4y ago

> Depends by who you mean by 'we'.

Climate change is a global problem, so the only 'we' that really matters is the whole planet.

Damogran64y ago

We’re just outsourcing our pollution.

anonporridge4y ago

Great point.

imtringued4y ago

Around 14% of China's CO2 emissions can be attributed to exports. If you count the other 86% you're basically saying China is a western colony which it clearly isn't.

Damogran64y ago

https://www.chinaghostcities.com/ https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-10-17/China-steps-up-expandi... https://chinaenv.colgate.edu/airpollution/air-pollution-in-c...

I used to think it'd be a wave that followed cheap labor...I hope it doesn't as I don't think the planet has enough runway to support it.

CameronNemo4y ago

And where do most Chinese exports go to?

itzprime4y ago

Yes, but that is mainly due to the US & EU using more gas.

fulafel4y ago

And "reliant" - most of it goes to goods and services that are just nice to have.

sumedh4y ago

> The principle increase in coal use is China.

because it builds products for US and EU?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse