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0 pointsTomSwirly4y ago0 comments

> usually people are pretty receptive to just about anything as long as you respect them.

Non-American here.

I lived in the United States for over thirty years. My experience was different.

I lost a lot of friends in the last ten years, because they started posting completely ridiculous, crazy stuff and were completely defensive of even the most reasonable objections.

I'd put up with "Obama is a Muslim" for a long time, but then it started to escalate. People would get hostile when you mentioned that there were records showing otherwise. After the election, some people become convinced that Michelle Obama was in fact a transgender man and let me hear all about it.

And you know, it's hard not to get a little pissed off about such blatant lies, hmm?

A long-time friend of mine started posting about Sandy Hook being a hoax - that the school had never existed. I pointed out that a friend-of-a-friend of mine had lost two children there, and my friend just went ballistic and started calling me the most unbelievable names, "Do your homework!" I unfriended her. You could see her get more unhinged on other people's pages and unfriended, and I haven't heard anything from her in years.

And now we have terrible lies about medical data, and again, people become incredibly defensive. At least two acquaintances accused me of being a pharmaceutical company shill! (I've never worked anything remotely like that.)

Sorry, it's not just "politeness" - a significant portion of Americans just went off the rails in the last decade.

0 comments

Kye4y ago

Spot on.

I finally a cut a relative off after his long slide deeper into extremism culminated in posting Facebook memes demeaning me and people I cared about leading up to the 2016 election. I'm sure he thinks it was out of nowhere because he brushed me off when I asked him to stop saying such cruel and ignorant things.

Said relative was completely unmoved every time I said "that's me. You know me. Why are you saying these things about me? Why are you saying these things about people who matter to me?"

We were strangers long before I realized it. 2016 was just the wakeup call. There's no difference to me between people claiming relatives cut them off out of nowhere "over politics" and estranged parents in estranged parent forums who don't understand why their kids went no contact. They know or were at least told. But they didn't listen.

kelseyfrog4y ago

Growing up I was told hundreds of times "not to believe everything you read on the internet." Parents, teachers, relatives, and older folks all told me that. It was a cliche, and us younger people made fun of it being a cliche in the same way we made fun of downloading cars. Even so, it stuck with me.

Then it stopped. No one said it anymore. What happened?

techdragon4y ago

Unscrupulous marketing people discovered the effectiveness of doublespeak. They turned the natural suspicion of internet information back at itself by implying that “the other people on the internet are lying to you, I’m going to tell you the real truth” and because everyone knows you can’t trust the internet they are subtly manipulated into being more likely to believe something new that is untrue.

popcube4y ago

every one connected to Facebook>

slowhand094y ago

"A long-time friend of mine started posting about Sandy Hook being a hoax - that the school had never existed. I pointed out that a friend-of-a-friend of mine had lost two children there, and my friend just went ballistic and started calling me the most unbelievable names, "Do your homework!""

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_s...

I see no siblings on the list of victims. Your friend-of-a-friend story sounds like some information was omitted which impacts credibilty.

pvaldes4y ago

> I see no siblings

Siblings is not the only combination possible, people can mourn a son and his cousin for example, or the best friend of your son, or the son of a close friend. Most people would describe the experience as losing two children.

I'm not claiming that the history is neither real or is false, just that the data don't point clearly to one or the other option

slowhand094y ago

Siblings IS the only combination, unless you are playing word games. You have a job, with benefits available. Go to HR, tell them you want the additional coverage for your children. Mention that one is your best friend's child. Or your daughters best friend. When concise wording matters, this choice will become important. Else it is like the collective "we lost favorite actor|humanatarian|humorist|etc person this year" stuff in clickbait headlines. The collective "we" is about manipulation of perception and feelings.

This is not to minimize the loss felt by the poster I replied to's friend-of-a-friend. Its about not misleading by choice of words. Isn't that a big part of the original post?

drekk4y ago

You don't know that, you're going off of last names. Why are we justifying conspiratorial thinking

RickJWagner4y ago

Ah. But the people making the outlandish accusations were your friends, right?

Imagine if it was the media. (Remember the Steele dossier?)

Or if the people making the most noise were actually the worst offenders. (Harvey Weinstein, Michael Avenatti, Mario Cuomo, Chris Cuomo, most recently John Griffin.... 'Party of Women', anyone?)

There is enough craziness to go around, I assure you.

I have crazy friends on both sides. I hope a return to sanity can happen.

azinman24y ago

My close friend used to be a democrat, then became a Trumper and even worked in his administration. We got into a lot of heated debates, and our friendship finally about ended when he recently told me I was “lying to protect my political allies,” which is about the most rediculous statement I could imagine. Not only do I not have political allies (I’m not in politics), but I’m also giving pointing out opinions and evidence contrary to his viewpoint, which he dismisses as a lie (versus debatable points). It’s gotten so absurd, and I blame media on this one. People go into self-reinforcing areas that just get more and more extreme as people try to score points within their own clan. It’s sad, as he was one of the only people I knew that voted for Trump that I could have a real discussion with. Now I just watch it all from afar.

andrei_says_4y ago

It’s as if an evil sorcerer kidnapped our friends and family members and turned them into minions.

We could say that brainwashing and propaganda are black magic - after all they turn brother against brother and mother against daughter. Extremism, dehumanization, division often end up in violence on massive scale.

Being able to cheaply and efficiently hypnotize people into an alternate reality and maintaining that is… what kind of power?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 pointsTomSwirly4y ago0 comments

> usually people are pretty receptive to just about anything as long as you respect them.

Non-American here.

I lived in the United States for over thirty years. My experience was different.

I lost a lot of friends in the last ten years, because they started posting completely ridiculous, crazy stuff and were completely defensive of even the most reasonable objections.

And you know, it's hard not to get a little pissed off about such blatant lies, hmm?

Sorry, it's not just "politeness" - a significant portion of Americans just went off the rails in the last decade.

0 comments

Kye4y ago

Spot on.

Said relative was completely unmoved every time I said "that's me. You know me. Why are you saying these things about me? Why are you saying these things about people who matter to me?"

kelseyfrog4y ago

Then it stopped. No one said it anymore. What happened?

techdragon4y ago

popcube4y ago

every one connected to Facebook>

slowhand094y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_s...

I see no siblings on the list of victims. Your friend-of-a-friend story sounds like some information was omitted which impacts credibilty.

pvaldes4y ago

> I see no siblings

I'm not claiming that the history is neither real or is false, just that the data don't point clearly to one or the other option

slowhand094y ago

This is not to minimize the loss felt by the poster I replied to's friend-of-a-friend. Its about not misleading by choice of words. Isn't that a big part of the original post?

drekk4y ago

You don't know that, you're going off of last names. Why are we justifying conspiratorial thinking

RickJWagner4y ago

Ah. But the people making the outlandish accusations were your friends, right?

Imagine if it was the media. (Remember the Steele dossier?)

Or if the people making the most noise were actually the worst offenders. (Harvey Weinstein, Michael Avenatti, Mario Cuomo, Chris Cuomo, most recently John Griffin.... 'Party of Women', anyone?)

There is enough craziness to go around, I assure you.

I have crazy friends on both sides. I hope a return to sanity can happen.

azinman24y ago

andrei_says_4y ago

It’s as if an evil sorcerer kidnapped our friends and family members and turned them into minions.

Being able to cheaply and efficiently hypnotize people into an alternate reality and maintaining that is… what kind of power?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse