> quality backend modules and shitty 100-dependencies web modules

As someone who works in both stacks, I have seen incredibly shitty backend modules that dump 400mb of node_module deps.

I'd even argue node ecosystem is at fault because frontend adopted their package manager and "best practices".

So off of your high horse.

And Deno's goal of web compatible is in using web APIs where applicable instead of special snowflakes ( eg the web crypto api as browsers use vs nodes crypto module) and being permission focused rather than access by default. Feel free to debate the merits of that instead.

What's the real problem with 100 dependencies and size of a folder? I can name only non-cached install time, which is irrelevant for a regular developer.

What is "shitty"? Do we have something better than that? Like one big web framework which is both maintainable, DCE-able and solved everything frontend ever needs? Why further modularization of this theoretical module would be shitty?

Edit: Also, what are we comparing to? VS202x takes several gigabytes for a base set of libraries. Xcode is tens of gigabytes now, afaik. Qt is few gigabytes. Enterprise systems also take few gigabytes at least. But when node_modules takes more than 80mb to produce a 0.5mb bundle for a webscale product, we start to complain. I don't understand.

Thing is - unless you really love JS for some weird reason, then deno is competing with established languages like “go” that have a great web server in the standard library. In addition to competing with node which is fine! Apart from it’s insane package management situation. Which most people just kind of shrug at

I maintain Nodemailer and moved to the zero dependency model years ago (Nodemailer only has some development dependencies needed to run the test suite but no production dependencies). Mostly though, because npm versions of that time were super slow – aggregating all modules into a single package took install time to around a single second while the same code separated into modules took like 15 seconds or more to install. It turned out to have other benefits as well. For example, it is far easier to support older platforms (Nodemailer supports all Node.js versions since Node v6) if your dependencies do not start using the latest ES syntax overnight.