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0 pointsmoralestapia3y ago0 comments

>apartment buildings with permacultured gardens growing their own food

This has been tried (and proved wrong) countless times. The issue is that it needs a huge footprint, and space is something you don't have at large in apartment buildings.

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CalRobert3y ago

Thought it was more to have a pleasant place to hang out and the odd fresh tomato, etc.. I hope nobody seriously thinks you can feed an apartment building from the roof.

Most estimates say if you want to do permaculture/homestead living and provide your own calories you need a good acre per person and a taste for sweet potatoes...

YossarianFrPrez3y ago

Good point. I would guess that if electric bikes and other mobility options come online, maybe there will be less need for parking lots to be as large as they are now?

Even if apartment buildings are too dense, I still think we will see an increase in eco-village type arrangements.

moralestapiaOP3y ago

Yes, definitely. The farm will be close to the community again.

onionisafruit3y ago

Subsistence farms are making a comeback?

elicash3y ago

I'm not familiar at all with this space. Is vertical farming a possible solution here?

moralestapiaOP3y ago

It would be very expensive.

One person needs about 5 hectares of land to be self-sufficient (i.e. to cover all its food needs, including protein). If you can afford your own 432 Park Avenue (Cost: ~$1BUSD, Floor area: ~4ha) for that, then the answer is yes.

But also, with that same $1BUSD you could buy around 100,000 hectares of land in rural US, close to the size of Qatar; you can see how relatively inefficient vertical farming is in economic terms.

tomtheelder3y ago

Disclaimer: I am also very skeptical of the whole concept of vertical farming, but...

That 5 hectares of land per person metric is totally inapplicable here. Sort of the entire point of vertical farming is to be (in theory) vastly more efficient per unit of land. If you believe the claims it's somewhere between a 10 and 50 times reduction in land usage for same output.

5 hectares is also on the very high end for estimates of that metric. It also drops hugely if you're not relying on animal products.

I don't think vertical farming in apartments is the future, but I think your calculations here are also way, way off.

2 more replies

elicash3y ago

Was not aware these projects were trying to be self-sufficient! Yeah, that's pretty wild. I assumed from your comment they just wanted to have their own tomatoes or something.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

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CalRobert3y ago

Thought it was more to have a pleasant place to hang out and the odd fresh tomato, etc.. I hope nobody seriously thinks you can feed an apartment building from the roof.

Most estimates say if you want to do permaculture/homestead living and provide your own calories you need a good acre per person and a taste for sweet potatoes...

YossarianFrPrez3y ago

Good point. I would guess that if electric bikes and other mobility options come online, maybe there will be less need for parking lots to be as large as they are now?

Even if apartment buildings are too dense, I still think we will see an increase in eco-village type arrangements.

moralestapiaOP3y ago

Yes, definitely. The farm will be close to the community again.

onionisafruit3y ago

Subsistence farms are making a comeback?

elicash3y ago

I'm not familiar at all with this space. Is vertical farming a possible solution here?

moralestapiaOP3y ago

It would be very expensive.

But also, with that same $1BUSD you could buy around 100,000 hectares of land in rural US, close to the size of Qatar; you can see how relatively inefficient vertical farming is in economic terms.

tomtheelder3y ago

Disclaimer: I am also very skeptical of the whole concept of vertical farming, but...

5 hectares is also on the very high end for estimates of that metric. It also drops hugely if you're not relying on animal products.

I don't think vertical farming in apartments is the future, but I think your calculations here are also way, way off.

2 more replies

elicash3y ago

Was not aware these projects were trying to be self-sufficient! Yeah, that's pretty wild. I assumed from your comment they just wanted to have their own tomatoes or something.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse