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0 pointscarlmr2y ago0 comments

It's also a liability issue. If a company allows tinkering with the software in the car it opens itself up to massive lawsuits.

If we have a right to repair here, we also need to see how to handle liability here. If you flash your own software on the motor controller and subsequently mow through a group of people because you forgot to do a plausibility check on the accelerator pedal value who takes responsibility then?

Even if you just get the original software, how do we ensure you flash it correctly?

If you get the schematics, how do we know used the right parts that are rated for 125°C temperatures.

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anaganisk2y ago

Lol, this is absolute funny, every example you came up with has already been there for years. Aren't cars being modded every day, ECU tuning, engine mods, etc? Go ahead sue the company, companies aren't some innocent babies, they can afford to quickly dismiss the claim by just pointing towards the mod. Auto Companies have never been held liable for a car that has been modded. Does it waste money to be sued? Yes! But does it save a lot of money for consumers and is much better for the environment? Yes! If companies are greedy/selfish about their profits then consumers don't need to think about how right to repair hurts those companies.

bluGill2y ago

The EPA has suggested they will hold companies liable in the future. It hasn't happened yet, but they are hinting. If it is just one hobbyist they don't care, but there is a whole industry of chip your diesel truck and those chips clearly increase pollution. A modern diesel truck doesn't emit black smoke, but a large % of the diesel trucks you see are "rolling coal" which is a sure sign that someone has disabled the emissions controls.

yellowapple2y ago

> The EPA has suggested they will hold companies liable in the future.

The EPA can suggest all it wants. Holding one entity liable for the actions of an entirely different entity beyond the control of the former's is asinine, and I can guarantee you these automakers will gladly sic their armies of lawyers at a Supreme-Court-bound case and/or their armies of lobbyists at legislatively castrating the EPA if the EPA made any such attempt.

On top of that, the EPA is virtually irrelevant for EVs, and yet EVs are just as locked down (if not moreso), so I don't buy the "EPA might punish us" argument for that reason, too.

Gordonjcp2y ago

Not disabled the emissions controls, but deliberately remapped it to grossly overfuel at large throttle settings.

Why people want to trade off power for a big cloud of black smoke is beyond me, but there we are. If they want to get 50bhp from a nine litre engine, that's their concern.

Gordonjcp2y ago

"ECU tuning" is just fiddling about with some values in a lookup table, though.

overthrow2y ago

The liability excuse is a lie told to you by companies trying to increase their profits.

Who is liable if you tweak the software on your 2023 Mercedes? The same person who is liable if you tweak the hardware on your 1987 Chevy. There's plenty of precedent on how to deal with this.

yellowapple2y ago

> If you flash your own software on the motor controller and subsequently mow through a group of people because you forgot to do a plausibility check on the accelerator pedal value who takes responsibility then?

I would, obviously, for making the unsafe modification. In what multiverse would the manufacturer be liable for something entirely outside the manufacturer's control?

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0 pointscarlmr2y ago0 comments

It's also a liability issue. If a company allows tinkering with the software in the car it opens itself up to massive lawsuits.

Even if you just get the original software, how do we ensure you flash it correctly?

If you get the schematics, how do we know used the right parts that are rated for 125°C temperatures.

0 comments

anaganisk2y ago

bluGill2y ago

yellowapple2y ago

> The EPA has suggested they will hold companies liable in the future.

On top of that, the EPA is virtually irrelevant for EVs, and yet EVs are just as locked down (if not moreso), so I don't buy the "EPA might punish us" argument for that reason, too.

Gordonjcp2y ago

Not disabled the emissions controls, but deliberately remapped it to grossly overfuel at large throttle settings.

Why people want to trade off power for a big cloud of black smoke is beyond me, but there we are. If they want to get 50bhp from a nine litre engine, that's their concern.

Gordonjcp2y ago

"ECU tuning" is just fiddling about with some values in a lookup table, though.

overthrow2y ago

The liability excuse is a lie told to you by companies trying to increase their profits.

Who is liable if you tweak the software on your 2023 Mercedes? The same person who is liable if you tweak the hardware on your 1987 Chevy. There's plenty of precedent on how to deal with this.

yellowapple2y ago

I would, obviously, for making the unsafe modification. In what multiverse would the manufacturer be liable for something entirely outside the manufacturer's control?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse