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0 pointsdoctorpangloss2y ago0 comments

Adopting RxJava means fixing all the bugs in everything up front. That is why it feels complex. In my opinion and in the opinion of other adopters, it is a more expressive way to define correct behavior.

This is essentially the same tension between static and dynamic typing.

No matter what, all bug free code is complex. Correct code can be written in any paradigm.

But productful code ships with bugs.

Does test user creation need to be bug free? I don’t know. It feels like something where productful test user creation can ship with bugs, even if in reality your test code harnesses should not be buggy.

You can step even further back and ask: when you have essentially unlimited resources, why ship buggy code at all? Netflix has unlimited capital, and it isn’t in a hurry anywhere. Engineers should never choose productful over bug-free. You learn nothing (Netflix’s product problem will never resemble your startup’s product problem) and you forfeit the opportunity to learn (ReactiveX is a good, expressive paradigm).

This is a startup forum, is this true for startups? IMO, yes. Your startup is going to fail. You will not learn valuable product lessons from the journey. I mean people certainly pretend and say they do, but even in the situation of success, Brian Chesky still hasn’t become Walt Disney last I checked. But once you have enough money to be employed for a year, as an engineer, you know, fucking learn how to do something the right way, bug free and performantly.

So I agree your coworkers are fundamentally making an error.

0 comments

John238322y ago

> Adopting RxJava means fixing all the bugs in everything up front. That is why it feels complex.

I disagree with this. It mentally changes the thought processes when debugging, which was the biggest issue that was brought up.

> Does test user creation need to be bug free? I don’t know. It feels like something where productful test user creation can ship with bugs, even if in reality your test code harnesses should not be buggy.

It should be bug free at Netflix scale. My service created more customers daily than Netflix signed up monthly. It also sat in the middle of Growth. People use it to gate deployments. It needs to work flawlessly (or at least consistently).

jakewins2y ago

This was part of some “testing in production” type scheme?

Are there any talks or blog posts on how y’all wired this up, lessons learned etc?

John238322y ago

No this all happened in preprod. Every team in the growth space ran their own tests across the various permutations of users (country, payment type, plan, ... at the time free trial, feature flags) to determine if their code was valid and worked to go to production. Each team continuously deployed independently. Given that we also were continuously integrating as well... you get a lot of customers created.

Sorry no talks.

brabel2y ago

I tried using an API based on RxJava to implement some async code... It was buggy as hell, as using the API correctly was nearly impossible for me - that's the opposite of a good API which makes it very hard to use wrong. I am in the process of replacing all that shitty code with Virtual Threads, and all bugs just immediately disappear as the code is so much more straightforward to analyse.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 pointsdoctorpangloss2y ago0 comments

This is essentially the same tension between static and dynamic typing.

No matter what, all bug free code is complex. Correct code can be written in any paradigm.

But productful code ships with bugs.

So I agree your coworkers are fundamentally making an error.

0 comments

John238322y ago

> Adopting RxJava means fixing all the bugs in everything up front. That is why it feels complex.

I disagree with this. It mentally changes the thought processes when debugging, which was the biggest issue that was brought up.

jakewins2y ago

This was part of some “testing in production” type scheme?

Are there any talks or blog posts on how y’all wired this up, lessons learned etc?

John238322y ago

Sorry no talks.

brabel2y ago

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse