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0 points1vuio0pswjnm711mo ago0 comments

"... a huge frontpage discussion about this topic just a few days ago"

The previous discussion was about an April 11, 2025 joint letter to Harvard President Alan Garber from the Commissioner of the Federal Aquisition Service, General Services Administration, the Acting General Counsel of the Department of Health and Human Services and the Acting General Counsel of the Department of Education.

https://www.harvard.edu/research-funding/wp-content/uploads/...

Discussion of the April 11th letter occurred in stories submitted at 2025-04-14T18:40:22 and 2025-04-14T18:13:07

This discussion is about an April 16, 2025 letter to Maureen Martin at Harvard's International Office from the Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security.

https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/60233385...

This story was submitted 2025-04-17T10:42:01. Discussion of this letter on April 14th would have been impossible. It was not sent until April 16th.

As one might guess, the letters make different requests. The threatened consequences for not complying are also different. Different letters, different senders, different recipients, different sets of requests, different types of potential consequences for noncompliance, e.g., cancelling funding versus refusing to grant student visas. Are these truly the same topic. Let the reader decide.

Is it possible the reason for these stories getting flagged is because HN users with flagging privileges do not want to them discussed. Not because of repetition but because the discussions are often low quality or offensive to them in some way.

One could argue HN routinely keeps having the same discussions about the same topics, even going so far as to allow HN users to resubmit stories for discussion. Hence, comments frequently note "past discussion".

For example, an HN Poll last year showed most HN readers who vote in polls thought "AI" was mostly hype. Comments have also suggested readers are tired of the hype. Yet they are still being forced to see/hide stories about "AI" every day on HN. Sometimes it feels like HN commenters are literally being forcefed the same tired, old topics and coaxed to repeat their same old opinions, or worse, their favourite memes, over and over again.

I am not suggesting there is anything HN can do about this problem. But I am inclined to agree with the GP comment; the current flagging behaviour mirrors the worst of HN commenting behaviour. It is a low quality, cowardly attempt at moderation that does not even seem to work. We are now consistently seeing flagged stories remain on page 1.

0 comments

dang11mo ago

> Let the reader decide.

There is no "the" reader. There's a statistical cloud of readers with highly variant preferences.

You guys need to understand that the community is divided about these questions. I don't mean divided politically on partisan lines (though that as well), I mean divided around what sorts of topics are the best fit for the site.

There are those who feel like each letter to each government agency is a major new story that obviously deserves frontpage time; and there are those who feel like HN is overrun with this sort of thing already. Ditto for every major topic including, as you say, AI: some feel like there's too much, some feel like there's not enough.

There's no HN user, including me, who's satisfied with the balance of stories on the front page. The more passionate you (I don't mean you personally, but all of us) are about a particular topic, the more it feels like the topic is being unfairly and outrageously suppressed, whether by user flags or the mods or both.

This is ultimately all coming from the fundamentals of how HN works—from its initial conditions, if you like—and those aren't likely to change. Feelings about it do uptick during times of political intensity, such as now, but the underlying phenomenon is consistent and has been for many years.

Edit: here's me making a similar point from 5 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22644521, in case anyone was thinking this is a new phenomenon...

1vuio0pswjnm7OP11mo ago

Flagging does not remove stories. It does not always result in killng them to "[dead]" status. It may not even demote stories off page 1. Flagging is not a effective solution to the submission of stories that anyone believes are inappropriate for HN, i.e., it does not stop further submissions on similar topics. They still get submitted. If anything, flagging may be a means of stopping discussion. If it works. Meanwhile "[flagged]" status was removed from this story. Discussion continues.

dang11mo ago

I think I agree with every one of these sentences! Were you in disagreement with something I wrote?

The tug-of-war between upvotes and flags is always happening on HN and is a core part of how the software and the community function.

1 more reply

1vuio0pswjnm7OP10mo ago

Three threads on front page at same time, all covering same topic:

https://news.ycombinator.com/front?day=2025-05-01

1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43856795

2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43852145

3. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43859814

None flagged for "repitition"

pvg11mo ago

The linked discussion was on April 14th. Very few topics that narrow get two back to back megathreads on HN. Fundamentally, you're arguing this one should get three (or more) megathreads and that's a very uphill argument because it runs against the basic design fabric of the place.

1vuio0pswjnm7OP11mo ago

NB. "The reader" is a figure of speech refering to the reader who is reading the comment, whomever that may be. The point of the comment is that "repetition" is probably not an adequate explanation for flagging. Unless readers are informed who is flaggging and for what purpose, then all anyone can do is guess. No one knows why stories are flagged except the people who flag them.

Whether some HN practice has always been the case or whether it will remain so for all time is irrelevant. What's relevant is that aggressive flagging is happening now. Commenters share their thoughts about it. Some disagree. Some agree. Discussion continues.

pvg11mo ago

The point of the comment is that "repetition" is probably not an adequate explanation for flagging. [...] What's relevant is that aggressive flagging is happening now.

Why not? Why does only the flagging need to be explained but not, say, the aggressive reposting of stories that are typically, and by long-established practice, offtopic for HN? These are clearly two sides of the same phenomenon, it's not obvious that the flagging alone here should be treated as some sort of anomaly.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 points1vuio0pswjnm711mo ago0 comments

"... a huge frontpage discussion about this topic just a few days ago"

https://www.harvard.edu/research-funding/wp-content/uploads/...

Discussion of the April 11th letter occurred in stories submitted at 2025-04-14T18:40:22 and 2025-04-14T18:13:07

This discussion is about an April 16, 2025 letter to Maureen Martin at Harvard's International Office from the Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security.

https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/60233385...

This story was submitted 2025-04-17T10:42:01. Discussion of this letter on April 14th would have been impossible. It was not sent until April 16th.

0 comments

dang11mo ago

> Let the reader decide.

There is no "the" reader. There's a statistical cloud of readers with highly variant preferences.

Edit: here's me making a similar point from 5 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22644521, in case anyone was thinking this is a new phenomenon...

1vuio0pswjnm7OP11mo ago

dang11mo ago

I think I agree with every one of these sentences! Were you in disagreement with something I wrote?

The tug-of-war between upvotes and flags is always happening on HN and is a core part of how the software and the community function.

1 more reply

1vuio0pswjnm7OP10mo ago

Three threads on front page at same time, all covering same topic:

https://news.ycombinator.com/front?day=2025-05-01

1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43856795

2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43852145

3. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43859814

None flagged for "repitition"

pvg11mo ago

1vuio0pswjnm7OP11mo ago

pvg11mo ago

The point of the comment is that "repetition" is probably not an adequate explanation for flagging. [...] What's relevant is that aggressive flagging is happening now.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse