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0 pointsmindcrash7mo ago0 comments

If only the drama stopped there:

* DHH is not only considered racist / fascist due to some blog posts, but also for making Hyprland the default DE in Omarchy, developed by someone who goes by the name Vaxry Vaxerski, who is also considered fascist and racist, and thus banned from contributing to freedesktop projects due to supposed breach of CoC:

https://blog.vaxry.net/articles/2024-fdo-and-redhat

* Hyprland and all its contributors are now also considered fascist from taking sponsorship money from 37signals, DHH's company, due to it being an important part of Omarchy.

https://account.hypr.land/sponsors

* Due to the fact that both DHH and Vaxry are both considered fascist / racist, Framework and its CEO (yes, that Framework) are now considered to be supporters of fascism, because Framework is sponsoring and supporting both Omarchy and Hyprland.

https://account.hypr.land/sponsors

* Cloudflare (yes, that Cloudflare) is considered to support fascism because they support Omarchy and the Ladybird webbrowser (which is a project also run by someone considered to be a fascist)

https://blog.cloudflare.com/supporting-the-future-of-the-ope...

* Last but not least, Tobi (Shopify CEO) and thus Shopify are also considered by many to be supporters of fascism when this drama started to unroll for standing by DHH no matter what when activists wanted to deplatform and ban DHH from his own creation (Ruby on Rails). Which makes the Ruby Central drama due to the involvement of Shopify even more interesting:

https://xcancel.com/tobi/status/1970944464303923687

Me? I want to hop in a time machine back to the 90s/early 00s before all this crap started and everybody was just generally nice to each other.

0 comments

9rx7mo ago

> I want to hop in a time machine back to the 90s/early 00s before all this crap started and everybody was just generally nice to each other.

The internet was never nice. It, however, did at one time require technical savvy to use. With that savvy came the understanding that computers and people aren't the same thing, so when the computer emitted something not nice you'd laughed at how quant the technology was instead of getting your emotions all tied up in a knot and try to hold a person accountable like those who have no idea about what's going on around them do.

shadowgovt7mo ago

It turns out "the words the person are saying aren't the person" turned out to be a polite fiction as people who had been saying awful things for years online turned out to go on to act on those ideas.

We tried "Don't feed the trolls." It's how we got where we are now.

9rx7mo ago

People have always acted upon their (awful) ideas. In fact, the internet (DARPANET) itself was created as a tool to help combat exactly that. However, that is completely independent from what is emitted from a computer screen. To try to somehow bind them together is logically incoherent. Which technically-minded folks understand, but now that the technology has become so accessible that anyone can use it...

shadowgovt7mo ago

> However, that is completely independent from what is emitted from a computer screen

We may just be working under different definitions. Are you claiming that when I type things into, say, Hacker News and hit reply, the words you read aren't the words I wrote?

Or are you asserting the "person" of the words in the computer is not the same person I am behind the keyboard?

I'd argue that the latter is the disproven hypothesis. It turns out people who said awful things online were actually awful people; they may not show it as often in public, but they weren't different human beings. Broadly speaking, they believed the things they said and tended to act on them in real life.

Laughing off things on the computer as not real was how at least one shooting went unchecked.

philipallstar7mo ago

> Hyprland and all its contributors are now also considered fascist from taking sponsorship money from 37signals

This methodology is definitely not how you discover fascism. But it is how fascists and communists defined and traced their enemies in the 20th century.

badosu7mo ago

This.

While I am all for making conscious choices on what to support I can't take anything phrased like that seriously "all is contributors".

Hyprland, while inferior (imo) in some aspects to sway on the wayland tiling manager landscape is a fine piece of software that I use on my non-work computer (I still use sway for stability).

Back on the topic: I reiterate I'd be happy to avoid using or supporting projects based on non-purely technical issues (discussion on "pure technicality" omitted for brevity).

It's just... What, do I need to know every persons imo completely irrelevant opinions on whatever du jour hot political topic? Maybe the answer could be yes,

I would be fine with dropping Hyprland support, maybe I will after digging a bit more. But this whole thing just reeks to me of terminally informed and ragebaited people looking for a platform to vomit their completely irrelevant opinions, actions speak more (e.g. fostering a dangerous environment _adjacent to the project_ based on discrimination).

I just feel I want to nope out of this industry and everything related to it, it's very overwhelming.

the_gastropod7mo ago

> What, do I need to know every persons imo completely irrelevant opinions on whatever du jour hot political topic?

No. But if they're using their social capital they've built via their software contributions (like DHH) to spread racist nonsense, then maybe it's worth considering alternatives, or at the very least, stop supporting those projects.

badosu7mo ago

Sure, but I think there's a spectrum when making that decision:

"should keep their bullshit to themselves" <---> "should perhaps take leadership and avoid having their public channel a cesspool" <---> "actively encourages/participates in discriminatory practices" <---> "raging maniac hurting people, rallying for X"

Specifically on the topic of RubyGems:

I couldn't care less about what DHH posts or not, I certainly care that he uses his position to influence a chain of actors to interfere with something that always worked just because X.

I couldn't care less about the other side on the "cancel" mission, I care about influencing a chain of actors to interfere with something that always worked just because Y.

Please quarantine your political polarization/culture wars bullshit, non-anglo countries don't need it.

ljm7mo ago

Turns out guilt by association is problematic whether it’s a Gestapo tactic or a terminally online one.

People need to step back and breathe. It’s possible to feel one thing about a (frankly shite) blog post and its author without tarring everybody within six degrees of separation with the same brush, and it’s quite unsettling that people find such nuance so difficult.

preisschild7mo ago

I know vaxry made/allowed childish & offensive comments about trans folks, but has this gotten worse? Why is he considered a full on fascist now?

> Ladybird webbrowser (which is a project also run by someone considered to be a fascist)

Do you mean awesomekling? Why is he considered a fascist?

There are definitely actual fascists in tech (like Curtis Yarvin) which I (centrist liberal, not a tankie) fully support deplatforming where possible, but why are they considered fascists?

mindcrashOP7mo ago

> Do you mean awesomekling? Why is he considered a fascist?

I hope you can see this because my posts in this thread are getting attacked and downvoted.

This pretty much summarizes how it started (copied from Google):

https://lunduke.locals.com/post/5823666/ladybird-web-browser...

(note that while the exact word never is seen in evidence added to this post but it sure is or hinted towards elsewhere.)

and evidenced by this its ongoing:

https://xcancel.com/awesomekling/status/1971287738268909576

because some people disagree with things like this:

https://xcancel.com/awesomekling/status/1966456391146606806

And there are tons more posts that show that some people are not exactly nice towards him on his X timeline.

Also there's direct proof of these accusations out there but I will not link to those out of professional courtesy for those involved (yes, some people still have that).

preisschild7mo ago

I was on his side for the first link because I dont like people who have not contributed making PRs to change inoffensive wording either, but its unfortunate and disappointing to see him defending people like Kirk or dhh.

It should also be noted Lunduke is also not neutral and has his own political agenda.

queenkjuul7mo ago

Oh people were getting cancelled in the 90s and 00s

madeofpalk7mo ago

This is all... your opinion? Or some random twitter poster? Is there an appreciable amount of folks considering all of these people and companies fascist / racist?

kbelder7mo ago

"Everyone is a fascist except me and thee, and I'm not sure about thee."

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

9rx7mo ago

> I want to hop in a time machine back to the 90s/early 00s before all this crap started and everybody was just generally nice to each other.

shadowgovt7mo ago

We tried "Don't feed the trolls." It's how we got where we are now.

9rx7mo ago

shadowgovt7mo ago

> However, that is completely independent from what is emitted from a computer screen

We may just be working under different definitions. Are you claiming that when I type things into, say, Hacker News and hit reply, the words you read aren't the words I wrote?

Or are you asserting the "person" of the words in the computer is not the same person I am behind the keyboard?

Laughing off things on the computer as not real was how at least one shooting went unchecked.

philipallstar7mo ago

> Hyprland and all its contributors are now also considered fascist from taking sponsorship money from 37signals

This methodology is definitely not how you discover fascism. But it is how fascists and communists defined and traced their enemies in the 20th century.

badosu7mo ago

This.

While I am all for making conscious choices on what to support I can't take anything phrased like that seriously "all is contributors".

Hyprland, while inferior (imo) in some aspects to sway on the wayland tiling manager landscape is a fine piece of software that I use on my non-work computer (I still use sway for stability).

Back on the topic: I reiterate I'd be happy to avoid using or supporting projects based on non-purely technical issues (discussion on "pure technicality" omitted for brevity).

It's just... What, do I need to know every persons imo completely irrelevant opinions on whatever du jour hot political topic? Maybe the answer could be yes,

I just feel I want to nope out of this industry and everything related to it, it's very overwhelming.

the_gastropod7mo ago

> What, do I need to know every persons imo completely irrelevant opinions on whatever du jour hot political topic?

badosu7mo ago

Sure, but I think there's a spectrum when making that decision:

Specifically on the topic of RubyGems:

I couldn't care less about what DHH posts or not, I certainly care that he uses his position to influence a chain of actors to interfere with something that always worked just because X.

I couldn't care less about the other side on the "cancel" mission, I care about influencing a chain of actors to interfere with something that always worked just because Y.

Please quarantine your political polarization/culture wars bullshit, non-anglo countries don't need it.

ljm7mo ago

Turns out guilt by association is problematic whether it’s a Gestapo tactic or a terminally online one.

preisschild7mo ago

I know vaxry made/allowed childish & offensive comments about trans folks, but has this gotten worse? Why is he considered a full on fascist now?

> Ladybird webbrowser (which is a project also run by someone considered to be a fascist)

Do you mean awesomekling? Why is he considered a fascist?

There are definitely actual fascists in tech (like Curtis Yarvin) which I (centrist liberal, not a tankie) fully support deplatforming where possible, but why are they considered fascists?

mindcrashOP7mo ago

> Do you mean awesomekling? Why is he considered a fascist?

I hope you can see this because my posts in this thread are getting attacked and downvoted.

This pretty much summarizes how it started (copied from Google):

https://lunduke.locals.com/post/5823666/ladybird-web-browser...

(note that while the exact word never is seen in evidence added to this post but it sure is or hinted towards elsewhere.)

and evidenced by this its ongoing:

https://xcancel.com/awesomekling/status/1971287738268909576

because some people disagree with things like this:

https://xcancel.com/awesomekling/status/1966456391146606806

And there are tons more posts that show that some people are not exactly nice towards him on his X timeline.

Also there's direct proof of these accusations out there but I will not link to those out of professional courtesy for those involved (yes, some people still have that).

preisschild7mo ago

It should also be noted Lunduke is also not neutral and has his own political agenda.

queenkjuul7mo ago

Oh people were getting cancelled in the 90s and 00s

madeofpalk7mo ago

This is all... your opinion? Or some random twitter poster? Is there an appreciable amount of folks considering all of these people and companies fascist / racist?

kbelder7mo ago

"Everyone is a fascist except me and thee, and I'm not sure about thee."

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse